OH439 Interview with Mervyn Hewish (OutStories Bristol)
Please note this is not a full complete transcript but a detailed summary of the recording
Mervyn Hewish (MH) born in Newnham-on-Severn, Gloucestershire, 3 July 1947 (as Mervyn Michael Hubert Hill; adopted when 7). Describes origin of names. [00:00:53] Describes father’s marriages and children, mother’s death when he was baby. Passed into care of family friend, who also died. Goes to The Gables care home, joining sisters already there. Brothers then join MH and sisters from care home in Cinderford. [00:02:39] Story about sexual assault at care home by older boy, possibly own brother. Describes unhappiness in children’s homes and timidity. Story from age of approximately five [00:04:47] being shut in refectory by housemaster.
[00:05:40] Adopted by Hewish family age 7. [GOLDEN QUOTE:] “I knew I was different. I knew I was attracted to boys. I wanted to “play” in inverted commas with boys rather than girls.” Always felt attracted to boys – no particular age of realisation. [00:06:38] Story about “bad experience” aged 14. Describes mutual masturbation sessions with older boy who left to join Merchant Navy. [00:07:08] Describes being raped, how was scarred sexually by incident, didn’t tell anybody. [00:07:52] Describes relationship at 17 with older man who told MH he was getting married. [Golden quote:] “His perception of gay men then was you ended up a lonely old man. The idea of being a couple with someone didn’t exist.”
[00:08:49] Describes how didn’t think of self as gay, just different. Not sure what difference was until peers began going out with girls. Remembers all his girlfriends were because he fancied brothers. Assumed sex between men was normal. Story about camping trip with MH, girlfriend and plus her friend and boyfriend, MH and boyfriend share tent, MH assumes sex would occur, disappointed when didn’t. [00:11:06] MH meets girl, falls in love and proposes then breaks it off. Reunite and MH explained to her that he fancies men. [00:11:36] 1967, MH agrees to therapy to cure homosexuality. Visits GP. MH informs GP of concerns in letter, unable to tell face to face. MH unaware that electric shock therapy existed until informed by GP. [GOLDEN QUOTE: 00:12:53] “I went to the doctor because I knew I needed help. I had no idea what form that help would take.” [00:13:05] Visits clinic on Grove Road or Woodbury Lane nr Blackboy Hill in Bristol. Describes appearance of clinic, initial talking therapy then electrode treatment prescribed. MH initially relieved that “cure” available. [GOLDEN QUOTE 00:15:55] “I went in and they attached electrodes to my genitals. I was sat there in a hospital gown […] They brought in these big books. As you turned the page it was either a female or a male and I think some of them were nude. If it was a female, then nothing happened. But if it was a male, it was an electric shock, “which was quite excruciating.” Possibly two sessions of shock therapy. Doesn’t remember how long each session took. [00:16:10] Roleplay with therapist. Therapist asks MH if he had “done anything” as MH self-describes as being previously “prolific cottager” and still cottaging while therapy ongoing. [00:17:15] Describes role play, MH pretends to urinate in public toilet, therapist pretends to make pass at him. MH to get angry and challenge him, MH ad libs response [00:18:05 MH refers to piece of paper with quote on it][GOLDEN QUOTE:] “ I said something along the lines of ‘What are you looking at my cock for? Is yours so disgusting you can’t look at it?’ At which point the therapist laughed his head off and I remember thinking: oh my god, that’s the first sound of laughter I have ever heard in this place.” Medics decided he was cured but didn’t believe it himself. [GOLDEN QUOTE: 00:19:01]“I fervently believed at one point that I was evil, that I was possessed of demons that made me think this way.” Story about confirmation. [00:19:30] Gets married (late 1960s). [00:19:42] V013 asks about clinic: did MH ever see anyone else being treated? MH: No. Doesn’t remember doctors. Whole period blur – treatment lasted few weeks.
[00:20:45] Still cottaging when married. Story about being in love with Best Man when engaged. [00:21:35] V013: Why did therapists think you were cured? MH: because MH told them he was. Fools the people around him, including wife. [00:22:13] Marriage guidance counsellor later tells MH to accept himself for what he is: a gay man (late 1970s?). [GQ: 00:22:30] “Think of yourself as a beautiful person – a beautiful gay person”. [00:23:00] Story about involvement with male prostitute while still married. MH meets young man (YM) in cottages, MH not interested because too young. YM tells MH life story, MH feels sorry for him. End up in bed together but MH not interested. YM demands money, MH refuses but arranges job interview in Cheltenham, YM does not turn up. MH describes confrontation when sees him again. [00:26:17] MH offers to introduce YM to Gaysoc. Story about visiting Gaysoc member. YM says he is 16, MH believed he was 18 and thought this was age of consent. YM confesses to lying about age. MH leaves. Another man has sex with YM. [00:28:17] Months later, police arrive at MH’s house to arrest him for sex with YM, who kept diary with names, dates and places. Police visited all estate agents in region until found MH. Describes arrest in front of wife and daughter. Police co-operative. [00:29:37] MH taken to Gloucester Police Station, put in cells, fingerprinted and put on suicide watch. Describes fear of being in cell, agrees to tell all. Charged with “attempted buggery”. Story about release and journey home; policeman tells MH he regards him as victim as police after teachers who were having sex with YM. MH suspended from work, marriage failing. [GOLDEN QUOTE: 00:33:27] “My son got beaten up at school because his dad was a queer.” Story about working with scouts after police incident, involving private detective neighbour. Shunned by neighbours and friends. [00:35:14] Case goes to court, around time of ‘Playland’ court case in London. Describes trial and sentences, MH only one not to get custodial sentence. Loses job.
[00:37:50] Story about meeting YM again years later. Feelings about YM, effect on MH’s life, untruthful way YM presented in court and media. Describes how pitied YM as believed had similar life histories. Case made national news. Story about reaction of neighbours to MH and daughter. [00:41:50] How he got involved with Gaysoc in Gloucester while still married. [00:42:58] Gets new job at jewellers. Meets man in toilet who tries to blackmail him (late 1960s?). [00:43:59 - TAPE PAUSED BECAUSE DOG HAS COME INTO ROOM]. [00:44:07] Resumes attempted blackmail story: boss and police involved, police supportive. MH becomes manager of Bristol jewellery shop. Regularly visits sauna near Portland Square. Contracts syphilis. Visits the Bristol Clinic. Wife also tested [00:48:27 - TAPE PAUSED BECAUSE DOG HAS COME INTO ROOM]. [00:48:30] Difficulty of telling wife about his syphilis, thinks wife doubtful. Wife clear but MH frightened. MH falls in love with man. Describes feelings. Story about how they met. Became friends, families become friends. Intense relationship. Asks man to leave wife – says no. Remain friends although affair ends. MH believes himself capable of loving another man.
[00:52:40] Goes to marriage guidance counselling. [00:52:46 GOLDEN QUOTE:] “For the first time in my life, somebody said something positive about being gay. This marriage guidance counsellor, instead of telling me to pull myself together and go back to my wife, she actually said: ‘you are a gay man trapped in a marriage. We think you should come out.’” Counsellor offers help when MH ready. Describes plans for leaving wife, marriage and sexual problems. Story about how broke up. Describes inability to cope with marriage. [00:56:10] Early day of AIDS, worried about passing it onto family. Describes leaving family home and dilemma of what to do next. Stays with client for three months. Describes how he managed two different lives.
[00:58:50] Describes going out on scene in Bristol. Meets Andrew [current partner] soon after leaving wife (early 1980s). Wife unhappy MH has new partner. [01:00:09] GOLDEN QUOTE: “Life did become difficult trying to see my daughter because she wouldn’t allow her to come into contact with my gay friends.” Adopts fully gay lifestyle. Works for Gay Switchboard, campaigns for Aled Richards Trust. Story about starting antique business in early 1980s, clearing Aled’s flat. Describes how Andrew accepted MH’s promiscuity, describes open relationship in contrast to his marriage. No longer in contact with friends from married life but had gay friends. [01:03:04] Describes family’s reaction to his gay life, wife tells MH’s parents, MH cuts off contact with them, parents attempt to re-establish contact. Parents don’t let Andrew in house initially, eventually accept him. Story about parents’ change of attitude. [01:04:40] GOLDEN QUOTE: “My mother said ‘Your father’s very proud of you, you know.’ I said: ‘why, what have I done?’ She said: ‘Because you’ve stood up for what you believe in.’” Describes family’s attitude when he was growing up.
[01:05:15] Story about therapy sessions, made him feel at ease with sexuality and understand why he married. Story about his mother’s miscarriage. Describes how therapy helped, became totally honest with people after living double life. [01:07:37] GOLDEN QUOTE: “I used to go up to people and thrust it down their throat almost: ‘Hello, I’m Mervyn, I’m gay!” Describes freedom of telling people he is gay. “I became the person I was meant to be.” [01:08:31] Describes how sex ruled his life, how affected relationship with Andrew, how getting cancer made him better person. Been with Andrew 30 years. Story about meeting Andrew in The Elephant (bar), describes bar. Goes to Oasis nightclub same night, meets Andrew again. Describes relationship. MH was going to move to US but meeting Andrew stops him. [01:11:48] Describes how relationship has changed over years. Explains why don’t and won’t have civil partnership. MH and Andrew’s early life together, describes sex and passion. Story about MH changing profession from estate agent to antique dealers. Story about successful house clearance sale. Story about how business increased.
[01:18:00] Starts selling antiques in Bath, business is a success. Story about Visiting London and going to Portobello Road antiques market, eventually run a stall there on Saturdays for several years. Story about running stall and antique fairs in London. [01:21:59] Describes friend in London who was involved in musical theatre, story about visiting Jo Allen’s. Go to first Gay Pride in 1994, describes what it was like. Occasionally visits Bristol Pride. Goes to North Wales Pride in Bangor in 2012. [01:23:30] Still in contact with daughter, not in contact with adopted son, who sided with mother. Close to daughter. Has grandchildren.
[01:24:36] ENDS.
QUOTES “I knew I was different. I knew I was attracted to boys. I wanted to “play” in inverted commas with boys rather than girls.”
“His perception of gay men then was you ended up a lonely old man. The idea of being a couple with someone didn’t exist.”
“I went to the doctor because I knew I needed help. I had no idea what form that help would take.”
“I went in and they attached electrodes to my genitals. I was sat there in a hospital gown […] They brought in these big books. As you turned the page it was either a female or a male and I think some of them were nude. If it was a female, then nothing happened. But if it was a male, it was an electric shock,” which was quite excruciating.”
“ I said something along the lines of ‘What are you looking at my cock for? Is yours so disgusting you can’t look at it?’ At which point the therapist laughed his head off and I remember thinking: oh my god, that’s the first sound of laughter I have ever heard in this place.”
“I fervently believed at one point that I was evil, that I was possessed of demons that made me think this way.”
“My son got beaten up at school because his dad was a queer.”
“Think of yourself as a beautiful person – a beautiful gay person.”
“For the first time in my life, somebody said something positive about being gay. This marriage guidance counsellor, instead of telling me to pull myself together and go back to my wife, she actually said: ‘you are a gay man trapped in a marriage. We think you should come out.’”
“Life did become difficult trying to see my daughter because she wouldn’t allow her to come into contact with my gay friends.”
“My mother said ‘Your father’s very proud of you, you know.’ I said: ‘why, what have I done?’ She said: ‘Because you’ve stood up for what you believe in.’”
“I used to go up to people and thrust it down their throat almost: ‘Hello, I’m Mervyn, I’m gay!”
Mervyn Hewish (MH) born in Newnham-on-Severn, Gloucestershire, 3 July 1947 (as Mervyn Michael Hubert Hill; adopted when 7). Describes origin of names. [00:00:53] Describes father’s marriages and children, mother’s death when he was baby. Passed into care of family friend, who also died. Goes to The Gables care home, joining sisters already there. Brothers then join MH and sisters from care home in Cinderford. [00:02:39] Story about sexual assault at care home by older boy, possibly own brother. Describes unhappiness in children’s homes and timidity. Story from age of approximately five [00:04:47] being shut in refectory by housemaster.
[00:05:40] Adopted by Hewish family age 7. [GOLDEN QUOTE:] “I knew I was different. I knew I was attracted to boys. I wanted to “play” in inverted commas with boys rather than girls.” Always felt attracted to boys – no particular age of realisation. [00:06:38] Story about “bad experience” aged 14. Describes mutual masturbation sessions with older boy who left to join Merchant Navy. [00:07:08] Describes being raped, how was scarred sexually by incident, didn’t tell anybody. [00:07:52] Describes relationship at 17 with older man who told MH he was getting married. [Golden quote:] “His perception of gay men then was you ended up a lonely old man. The idea of being a couple with someone didn’t exist.”
[00:08:49] Describes how didn’t think of self as gay, just different. Not sure what difference was until peers began going out with girls. Remembers all his girlfriends were because he fancied brothers. Assumed sex between men was normal. Story about camping trip with MH, girlfriend and plus her friend and boyfriend, MH and boyfriend share tent, MH assumes sex would occur, disappointed when didn’t. [00:11:06] MH meets girl, falls in love and proposes then breaks it off. Reunite and MH explained to her that he fancies men. [00:11:36] 1967, MH agrees to therapy to cure homosexuality. Visits GP. MH informs GP of concerns in letter, unable to tell face to face. MH unaware that electric shock therapy existed until informed by GP. [GOLDEN QUOTE: 00:12:53] “I went to the doctor because I knew I needed help. I had no idea what form that help would take.” [00:13:05] Visits clinic on Grove Road or Woodbury Lane nr Blackboy Hill in Bristol. Describes appearance of clinic, initial talking therapy then electrode treatment prescribed. MH initially relieved that “cure” available. [GOLDEN QUOTE 00:15:55] “I went in and they attached electrodes to my genitals. I was sat there in a hospital gown […] They brought in these big books. As you turned the page it was either a female or a male and I think some of them were nude. If it was a female, then nothing happened. But if it was a male, it was an electric shock, “which was quite excruciating.” Possibly two sessions of shock therapy. Doesn’t remember how long each session took. [00:16:10] Roleplay with therapist. Therapist asks MH if he had “done anything” as MH self-describes as being previously “prolific cottager” and still cottaging while therapy ongoing. [00:17:15] Describes role play, MH pretends to urinate in public toilet, therapist pretends to make pass at him. MH to get angry and challenge him, MH ad libs response [00:18:05 MH refers to piece of paper with quote on it][GOLDEN QUOTE:] “ I said something along the lines of ‘What are you looking at my cock for? Is yours so disgusting you can’t look at it?’ At which point the therapist laughed his head off and I remember thinking: oh my god, that’s the first sound of laughter I have ever heard in this place.” Medics decided he was cured but didn’t believe it himself. [GOLDEN QUOTE: 00:19:01]“I fervently believed at one point that I was evil, that I was possessed of demons that made me think this way.” Story about confirmation. [00:19:30] Gets married (late 1960s). [00:19:42] V013 asks about clinic: did MH ever see anyone else being treated? MH: No. Doesn’t remember doctors. Whole period blur – treatment lasted few weeks.
[00:20:45] Still cottaging when married. Story about being in love with Best Man when engaged. [00:21:35] V013: Why did therapists think you were cured? MH: because MH told them he was. Fools the people around him, including wife. [00:22:13] Marriage guidance counsellor later tells MH to accept himself for what he is: a gay man (late 1970s?). [GQ: 00:22:30] “Think of yourself as a beautiful person – a beautiful gay person”. [00:23:00] Story about involvement with male prostitute while still married. MH meets young man (YM) in cottages, MH not interested because too young. YM tells MH life story, MH feels sorry for him. End up in bed together but MH not interested. YM demands money, MH refuses but arranges job interview in Cheltenham, YM does not turn up. MH describes confrontation when sees him again. [00:26:17] MH offers to introduce YM to Gaysoc. Story about visiting Gaysoc member. YM says he is 16, MH believed he was 18 and thought this was age of consent. YM confesses to lying about age. MH leaves. Another man has sex with YM. [00:28:17] Months later, police arrive at MH’s house to arrest him for sex with YM, who kept diary with names, dates and places. Police visited all estate agents in region until found MH. Describes arrest in front of wife and daughter. Police co-operative. [00:29:37] MH taken to Gloucester Police Station, put in cells, fingerprinted and put on suicide watch. Describes fear of being in cell, agrees to tell all. Charged with “attempted buggery”. Story about release and journey home; policeman tells MH he regards him as victim as police after teachers who were having sex with YM. MH suspended from work, marriage failing. [GOLDEN QUOTE: 00:33:27] “My son got beaten up at school because his dad was a queer.” Story about working with scouts after police incident, involving private detective neighbour. Shunned by neighbours and friends. [00:35:14] Case goes to court, around time of ‘Playland’ court case in London. Describes trial and sentences, MH only one not to get custodial sentence. Loses job.
[00:37:50] Story about meeting YM again years later. Feelings about YM, effect on MH’s life, untruthful way YM presented in court and media. Describes how pitied YM as believed had similar life histories. Case made national news. Story about reaction of neighbours to MH and daughter. [00:41:50] How he got involved with Gaysoc in Gloucester while still married. [00:42:58] Gets new job at jewellers. Meets man in toilet who tries to blackmail him (late 1960s?). [00:43:59 - TAPE PAUSED BECAUSE DOG HAS COME INTO ROOM]. [00:44:07] Resumes attempted blackmail story: boss and police involved, police supportive. MH becomes manager of Bristol jewellery shop. Regularly visits sauna near Portland Square. Contracts syphilis. Visits the Bristol Clinic. Wife also tested [00:48:27 - TAPE PAUSED BECAUSE DOG HAS COME INTO ROOM]. [00:48:30] Difficulty of telling wife about his syphilis, thinks wife doubtful. Wife clear but MH frightened. MH falls in love with man. Describes feelings. Story about how they met. Became friends, families become friends. Intense relationship. Asks man to leave wife – says no. Remain friends although affair ends. MH believes himself capable of loving another man.
[00:52:40] Goes to marriage guidance counselling. [00:52:46 GOLDEN QUOTE:] “For the first time in my life, somebody said something positive about being gay. This marriage guidance counsellor, instead of telling me to pull myself together and go back to my wife, she actually said: ‘you are a gay man trapped in a marriage. We think you should come out.’” Counsellor offers help when MH ready. Describes plans for leaving wife, marriage and sexual problems. Story about how broke up. Describes inability to cope with marriage. [00:56:10] Early day of AIDS, worried about passing it onto family. Describes leaving family home and dilemma of what to do next. Stays with client for three months. Describes how he managed two different lives.
[00:58:50] Describes going out on scene in Bristol. Meets Andrew [current partner] soon after leaving wife (early 1980s). Wife unhappy MH has new partner. [01:00:09] GOLDEN QUOTE: “Life did become difficult trying to see my daughter because she wouldn’t allow her to come into contact with my gay friends.” Adopts fully gay lifestyle. Works for Gay Switchboard, campaigns for Aled Richards Trust. Story about starting antique business in early 1980s, clearing Aled’s flat. Describes how Andrew accepted MH’s promiscuity, describes open relationship in contrast to his marriage. No longer in contact with friends from married life but had gay friends. [01:03:04] Describes family’s reaction to his gay life, wife tells MH’s parents, MH cuts off contact with them, parents attempt to re-establish contact. Parents don’t let Andrew in house initially, eventually accept him. Story about parents’ change of attitude. [01:04:40] GOLDEN QUOTE: “My mother said ‘Your father’s very proud of you, you know.’ I said: ‘why, what have I done?’ She said: ‘Because you’ve stood up for what you believe in.’” Describes family’s attitude when he was growing up.
[01:05:15] Story about therapy sessions, made him feel at ease with sexuality and understand why he married. Story about his mother’s miscarriage. Describes how therapy helped, became totally honest with people after living double life. [01:07:37] GOLDEN QUOTE: “I used to go up to people and thrust it down their throat almost: ‘Hello, I’m Mervyn, I’m gay!” Describes freedom of telling people he is gay. “I became the person I was meant to be.” [01:08:31] Describes how sex ruled his life, how affected relationship with Andrew, how getting cancer made him better person. Been with Andrew 30 years. Story about meeting Andrew in The Elephant (bar), describes bar. Goes to Oasis nightclub same night, meets Andrew again. Describes relationship. MH was going to move to US but meeting Andrew stops him. [01:11:48] Describes how relationship has changed over years. Explains why don’t and won’t have civil partnership. MH and Andrew’s early life together, describes sex and passion. Story about MH changing profession from estate agent to antique dealers. Story about successful house clearance sale. Story about how business increased.
[01:18:00] Starts selling antiques in Bath, business is a success. Story about Visiting London and going to Portobello Road antiques market, eventually run a stall there on Saturdays for several years. Story about running stall and antique fairs in London. [01:21:59] Describes friend in London who was involved in musical theatre, story about visiting Jo Allen’s. Go to first Gay Pride in 1994, describes what it was like. Occasionally visits Bristol Pride. Goes to North Wales Pride in Bangor in 2012. [01:23:30] Still in contact with daughter, not in contact with adopted son, who sided with mother. Close to daughter. Has grandchildren.
[01:24:36] ENDS.
QUOTES “I knew I was different. I knew I was attracted to boys. I wanted to “play” in inverted commas with boys rather than girls.”
“His perception of gay men then was you ended up a lonely old man. The idea of being a couple with someone didn’t exist.”
“I went to the doctor because I knew I needed help. I had no idea what form that help would take.”
“I went in and they attached electrodes to my genitals. I was sat there in a hospital gown […] They brought in these big books. As you turned the page it was either a female or a male and I think some of them were nude. If it was a female, then nothing happened. But if it was a male, it was an electric shock,” which was quite excruciating.”
“ I said something along the lines of ‘What are you looking at my cock for? Is yours so disgusting you can’t look at it?’ At which point the therapist laughed his head off and I remember thinking: oh my god, that’s the first sound of laughter I have ever heard in this place.”
“I fervently believed at one point that I was evil, that I was possessed of demons that made me think this way.”
“My son got beaten up at school because his dad was a queer.”
“Think of yourself as a beautiful person – a beautiful gay person.”
“For the first time in my life, somebody said something positive about being gay. This marriage guidance counsellor, instead of telling me to pull myself together and go back to my wife, she actually said: ‘you are a gay man trapped in a marriage. We think you should come out.’”
“Life did become difficult trying to see my daughter because she wouldn’t allow her to come into contact with my gay friends.”
“My mother said ‘Your father’s very proud of you, you know.’ I said: ‘why, what have I done?’ She said: ‘Because you’ve stood up for what you believe in.’”
“I used to go up to people and thrust it down their throat almost: ‘Hello, I’m Mervyn, I’m gay!”
