}
OH440 Interview with Martyn (OutStories Bristol)
Please note this is not a full complete transcript but a detailed summary of the recording
Martyn [M], born 4 March 1972 on council estate in South Bristol. Left at 17 and moved to Clifton Village. Started working at insurance company and met a man who took him to Elephant [gay pub on St Nicholas Street]. His mother had just moved away so decided to move to new area. Lived in bedsit in a house with Tricky [musician] and lots of journalists and creative people.
[00:01:37] Describes Elephant in 1989. “I remember it being purple but maybe my memories are wrong. And it was quite strange when you were a 16 or 17 year old going in there because everybody new everybody. It was a very small, insular scene. There were lots of characters in there.” Ian Stephens was landlord: describes how he spoke. Above fireplace was sign saying “There are no strangers here, only friends yet to meet” - he found that creepy as a teenager. He also went to the Oasis nightclub. [00:02: 24] “You had to lie about your age because obviously, think about the time. You had to be 21 to be gay, so I had to pretend to be 21, even though I looked about 15.” Story about telling the owners of club his real age. Most clientele were older; many of the younger men there were rent boys. He was offered a lot of money on several occasions. [00:33:30] No gay youth culture that he knew about at the time. Met his partner of the time at Oasis: he was 18, M was 17, therefore breaking the law. [00:03:55] Describes Flo behind the bar at the Oasis. “She was a little lady with a gravelly voice. What was her phrases? She used to go ‘Awwwwwwright?” She’d talk with a really deep voice. You’d go: ‘Whoah!’
[00:04:29] He and partner wanted to meet young people. Found advert in Venue [Bristol listing magazine] with a PO Box for Greenleaf bookshop advertising [he thinks] BLAGS, Bristol Lesbian and Gay Society. “You had to write a letter to the group - and that’s the interesting bit. You had to write this letter to the group, and then you’d be kind of accepted. But what used to happen was, you’d write a letter […] and then the members of the group would then read the letter and try and work out from the letter whether you were gay or not. And remember again you were breaking the law because you were under 21, so you had to be very careful about people, you know, what they might do with that and also because there was a lot of gay bashing at the time.” Two people meet letter-writer to check if they were gay. M and boyfriend went through process and were taken to meet rest of group. [00:05:56]. After joining group, he read letters and met people. Often went with his large, muscular friend from group to meet people. Story about a man from Trowbridge who wrote in, didn’t know anyone gay and worried it might be homophobic trap. [00:06:58] Would meet potential members by Hippodrome or Watershed [venues in Bristol]. After initial conversation, worked out whether they were genuine or not and if they were, took them to Elephant to meet rest of group or Griffin [gay pub on Colston Street], which became the gay youth group’s main meeting place. [00:07:27] Talks about criteria for judging whether people accepted to group: [00:37:34] “I think it was just obvious. It was people just writing, you know, ‘I don’t know anybody, I’m really lonely, I don’t know how to meet people. It’s quite painful, some of the stuff we used to get.” Sometimes people would write but not turn up. [00:07:53] Thinks Gay Switchboard might have been linked to youth group but not sure. In late 1980s, very different from now: people had to know who contact and where to find out information to get in touch with other gay people. Describes Greenleaf bookshop, on Colston Street, which sold feminist and left-wing books. [00:08:31] Doesn’t remember receiving any letters that looked untrustworthy or that they rejected, only remembers ones where the people didn’t turn up as tragic.
[00:08:50] Tries to remember how people contacted the gay youth group and vice versa. He thinks that people wrote to a PO Box number but can’t remember how they communicated back: can’t remember if the people who wrote in gave addresses. [00:09:17] Talks about the members of gay youth group: there were 20-30 members. He is still friends with four people he met there. He thinks youngest person might have been 15 or 16 and oldest 20. Not linked with other gay organisations in area, until Freedom Youth [LGBT youth group] came along several years later. He went to Freedom Youth at very beginning and met current partner there. [00:10:28] “We thought we had to do a role with sexual health as well because it was, again, a different time and sexual health just wasn’t addressed in schools […] but being gay was you know, ‘…and this is very much of a side issue’. Unlike pregnancy, you weren’t taught ‘what do you do if you get an STI? What happens?’” He read about sexual diseases and members of group would go to him if they had problem. He advised on medication or told them to go to the clinic and give them number. This was around 1990. [00:11:47] Thinks age limit for the youth group might have been 25, although he left at 20. Group folded because the leader didn’t want to do it anymore. [00:12:12] Describes membership of youth group as mixed male-female ratio. It mainly served social function. [00:12:24] “We blew up a load of balloons with Gay Switchboard on it and we took them in a net to the centre and we released them all because, again, someone might pick up the leaflet and go: ‘Switchboard. Blimey. I didn’t know that existed.” [00:13:00] Describes Freedom Youth: open people up to 25; based at Terrence Higgins Trust; held workshops - gay youth group more relaxed, less organised, more social. [00:13:49] Describes gay youth group social events: would phone members, tell them what pub to meet at and when. Usually meet at Elephant or Griffin then moved to Oasis or 49 [club on Christmas Steps], a more mixed straight-gay venue. [00:14:24] Describes Oasis club: men-only but once a year held a fundraiser that let in women, so he took his schoolfriend. [00:14:38] “You’d go to the door, and it was shut, and you’d have a little trapdoor on it. You used to knock the door and ring the bell, and then Hugh and Kevin who were on the door would open the trapdoor: ‘What d’you want?! Oh yeah, it’s you, come in.’ And you’d go in.” Everyone had to sign in, as was members-only. To get late licence it had to sell food, so had menu on display, although no-one ever ordered and food probably wasn’t on sale. You went down stairs. First noticeable thing was smell of poppers, then beat of music. When he started going he went early, as he didn’t like going to pubs on his own. Club was tiny and had small garden at back for talking and smoking. It also had two bars, dancefloor and piano in corner, which was played on Sundays. He felt it was stuck in 1970s.
[00:16:55] Talks about changing gay scene in Bristol. There was Elephant, Griffin, Oasis and 49 club, then Queen Shilling opened - he worked there as barman. When it opened, it changed scene because it was a modern pub, whereas Elephant and Griffin seemed closed, with closed curtains. [00:17:45] “The Shilling opened and the door used to be left open. You could see in the pub and that was really unusual. And then people started - I mean, again, the licensing laws have changed - but people drank outside the pub. Actually outside, they were drinking and smoking, well, you could smoke anywhere in those days. And it was a bit more kind of young, a bit more fun.” By late 1980s/early 1990s, he’d started going to Bang and Heaven [London clubs] and he’d seen what pubs and clubs could look like. Queen Shilling reminded him of London pub. When it opened in 1992 or 1993 Queen Shilling was pub rather than club, with bar on ground floor and raised dancefloor, so it was possible to sit and talk.
[00:19:23] He was terrified of AIDS as a young man. [00:19:25] “You were absolutely terrified. At all times. Seriously, it was like, like again, this is how maybe things have gone bad, maybe how people aren’t so aware now. But I remember [being in school] with the advert with John Hurt and all that kind of malarkey, and you came on the scene and you were absolutely terrified. You think, ‘if I drink a drink…’ He was frightened he might catch AIDS from glass in pub. Everyone was into safe sex, it was the norm. Now, it has changed and people are complacent because of anti-viral drugs and PEP. [00:20:28 - SOUND INTERFERENCE AS MICROPHONE DROPS OFF AND IS PINNED BACK ON] [00:20:50] Talks about safe sex education in late 1980s. Remembers John Hurt information film, thinks there may have been posters in Griffin. Condoms sold in Elephant. Responsibility was down to individual, who had to go and buy them: weren’t distributed free. Thinks safe sex was norm because of mass hysteria at time. [00:21:36] Story about article he read Sun newspaper about airline pilot bringing AIDS to UK. He doesn’t remember massive safe sex campaigns at time. Later it became part of youth group’s activity. Describes change in attitude at Milne Centre [STD clinic at BRI].
[00:22:16] He had boyfriends and girlfriends at school. [00:22:26 - CLOCK CHIMES] [00:22:37] “I didn’t know what I was, I was just doing whatever really] He had close female friends that he talked to about relationships with boys and it was a non-issue. [00:22:57] “I didn’t really get a lot of hassle with it either, probably because you wouldn’t really, because the tough boys who were going to hit you were the ones you were sleeping with, so you weren’t going to get any problems!” [00:23:25] Story about meeting old schoolfriend after they left school, who was amazed M was gay. Didn’t come out in school or to family -environment was too tough. Came out when he left home. [00:24:33] “It was a completely different world. You come from an area that had unemployment, unemployed people, single parent families and you moved into the city and you were suddenly living with boho types, your world completely changes. I am nothing like I was when I first came out. It’s completely opposite.” [00:24:57] His family now know he’s gay: he told his mother when she moved away when he was 17yo. [00:25:01] “I said to her if you don’t like it that’s your problem… it’s not my issue it’s your issue. If you’ve got a problem then you need to go and get your help.” [00:25:34] He lived in Clifton for three years: knew that was where lots of gay people lived. Story about conversation overheard on bus on day he moved to Clifton. After three years, moved to Brislington, which was boring. [00:26:55] After he left youth group, joined Stonewall, but mainly focused on having good time, clubbing in London, discovering Brighton. [00:27:33] Describes changing gay scene. Once Queen Shilling opened, others opened, like Flamingo Joe’s/Leo’s club, next to Elephant, around 1995-1996. Boy bands performed there, and LaToya Jackson. He worked there as barman. [00:28:29 - PHONE RINGS] [00:28:47] Describes Flamingo Joe’s: it had two bars, burger bar, big stage. He thinks it was too big and went bankrupt, as was only busy on weekends. [00:29:12] Talks about Oasis, which had limit on numbers, so if you couldn’t get in on new year’s eve, you probably couldn’t get in anywhere.
[00:29:50] As barman, M got free entry to all gay pubs and clubs in Bristol. After finishing shift he’d go to 49, Flamingo’s and Just [club]. Talks about what clubs were open and what had shut. Owner of Queen Shilling was renovating pub and deciding whether to move to Old Market because first gay venue on Old Market, Roosters, had opened. Then Old Castle Green taken over by former landlords of Griffin and owner of Just, Winn, was told club would be demolished. He turned old Lloyds Bank into club. By this stage Old Market Tavern was gay. There was also Castro’s, near Stag and Hounds. Whole scene moved to Old Market and because Queen Shilling was shut, young scene came too. He was in his mid-20s by now. Griffin became leather bar. Elephant was still traditional gay pub, but dying a bit. Around same time, Pineapple and Vibes opened. [00:33:22] “When the Shilling closed things moved to Old Market but the Shilling reopened and then other clubs opened round the Shilling.” Roosters closed and Mason’s Arms, a women’s bar opened. [00:33:53] He brings out membership cards of clubs from the time. He talks about membership card for Just on Fiennes Court; card for Winn’s (now R7, which he hasn’t been to). All clubs used to have membership cards, including Queen Shilling; not the case now. [00:34:45] “You always had to have a club card and you had to show them your card as well or they might have your name sometimes on a bit of paper… it just got you in the club! But you had to have it.” Bristol led way in social life - Just had first 24-hour licence in country: tested in Bristol. Went on until 6am and gave free toast and coffee to anyone who was still there. [00:35:38] “You used to go to the pub, especially like you’d go to the Elephant and you’d see all the sort of ‘stars’, as it were, like from years ago and they had like women’s names as well, which was weird. It was like: ‘Oh god, they’re called like Cilla and sort of like Dierdre. I wouldn’t say they were speaking Polari, but there was a little bit of it.” Mentions another local character called Tracey, who spoke Polari: he didn’t know what it was at time. Found out about it through Round the Horne [1960s Radio programme].
[00:36:28] If there was show on at Hippodrome [Bristol theatre] stars would always go to Oasis afterwards and get in free. [00:36:50] Shows ‘Glad to be gay’ flag from London Pride 1997. Coach trips from Bristol were organised each year from Bristol to London for Pride. Banners would be taken and people would march through London for their city - he doesn’t think this happens at Pride any more. He often went to Pride in London. His first was 1990 or 1991. [00:38:06] “That’s how things have changed. It was like going to a village fair, so people would actually make cakes and sell them there. And you had a dance tent, but it wasn’t like a dance-rave tent you would have now at a festival, it was like a smaller version of and you’d have a DJ in there, and you’d like be dancing with the people of the age. So you’d have like Jimmi Sommerville [1980s pop star] there, Marc Almond [pop star] right next to you and you could go and talk to them.” Very different to ‘superpride’/Mardi Gras experience of later years. He used to go as teenager with schoolfriends and was thrilled to be dancing with people he’d seen on Top of the Pops [TV programme]. The trips from Bristol to London were advertised on posters in gay pubs. You’d phone (he thinks it may have been through Greenleaf bookshop), get ticket, meet at designated place and go on bus. He did it every year until trips finished. [00:40:58] Talks about Pride London moving around and commercialism of event. Used to be able to take own alcohol and food. No gates around venue, so people could walk in. Then gates introduced, followed by wristbands, then token payment system. By time it was held in Hyde Park [2006?] it was ruined. He went to Pride 2012 in London in Trafalgar Square but didn’t enjoy it: just stalls giving out leaflets.
[00:41:21] Talks about Bristol Pride. First one he went to was in Watershed; he thinks it was organised by Berkeley [Berkeley Wilde, local activist]. Couple of Prides were held there in 1990s. Then one was held at the Trinity Centre [venue in Lawrence Hill]: didn’t work out because of far-flung location. He also went on march through Bristol with Freedom Youth. Little reaction to it from passersby. He doesn’t think Bristol is particularly homophobic, though he has been beaten up. [00:43:23] Talks about area he lives in [doesn’t want to say where it is]. All his friends live there and all go to the local pub and no-one bothers them. That wouldn’t have happened when he was younger. Finds now that there are few gay pubs where he can sit and chat: too loud. When he was teenager there were pubs where you could do this. Doesn’t find this in Brighton, where there is more variety on scene. [00:43:35 - TRY TO PAUSE TAPE WHILE HE GETS PHOTOGRAPHS OUT. PAUSE BUTTON DOESN’T WORK.] [00:44:47] V013 is shown photo of M when he was a teenager and had lots of bleached blonde hair and is standing in front of a Marilyn Monroe poster. [00:45:01] Describes picture of his friend’s 16th birthday at 49 club: it is of friend from gay youth group, school friends and other friends they met along way. Drinking underage at pubs and clubs was common. [00:45:42] Talks about how Bristol has changed: more open city; more choice of clubs. On old scene, it felt closed and bitchy. He doesn’t understand how young people make friends today through social networking. People talk about problems online but not face to face. [00:46:22] “A person writing in a letter to the old youth group, pouring their heart out, you’d know a lot about them before you even met them. And you felt for them and you just had to be grown up about it: how am I going to deal with that right? This person has come and they need some help. So you’d help them out, you’d introduce people. Whereas now, you can go onto Grinder, Gaydar, ping, ping, ping. Oh I’ve met someone - great! Two minutes later I’ve met someone else. What’s that about?” [00:47:20] He has been with his partner 18 years. They met at Freedom Youth. [00: 48:07] Of all places he has lived in Bristol, where he lives now [doesn’t want to say where] is his favourite because so many gay people live there. Story about going to local bar and it being full of gay people. He occasionally goes out on scene, mainly to Old Market Tavern. Story about visiting bar in Old Market, where he saw young man drinking from cocktail pitcher. (Male) staff behind bar are topless - he would have been unhappy doing it when he was barman and questions whether it should be part of job description. Talks about his days as barman, when customers would pour heart out to him, people crying at end of night. [00:51:57] Talks about gay night club called Lock Hill, on a boat in docks near where Bordeaux Quay now is, for a few months. [00:52:22 - CLOCK CHIMES] It had a bar and dancefloor - thinks it was the only gay club on boat in the UK. It attracted same crowd as rest of scene.
GOLDEN QUOTES [00:04:02] “She was a little lady with a gravelly voice. What was her phrases? She used to go ‘Awwwwwwright?” She’d talk with a really deep voice. You’d go: ‘Whoah!’
[00:04:53] “You had to write a letter to the group - and that’s the interesting bit. You had to write this letter to the group, and then you’d be kind of accepted. But what used to happen was, you’d write a letter […] and then the members of the group would then read the letter and try and work out from the letter whether you were gay or not. And remember again you were breaking the law because you were under 21, so you had to be very careful about people, you know, what they might do with that and also because there was a lot of gay bashing at the time.”
[00:37:34] “I think it was just obvious. It was people just writing, you know, ‘I don’ know anybody, I’m really lonely, I don’t know how to meet people. It’s quite painful, some of the stuff we used to get.”
[00:10:28] “We thought we had to do a role with sexual health as well because it was, again, a different time and sexual health just wasn’t addressed in schools […] but being gay was you know, ‘…and this is very much of a side issue’. Unlike pregnancy, you weren’t taught ‘what do you do if you get an STI? What happens?’
[00:12:24] “We blew up a load of balloons with Gay Switchboard on it and we took them in a net to the centre and we released them all because, again, someone might pick up the leaflet and go: ‘Switchboard. Blimey. I didn’t know that existed.”
[00:14:38] “You’d go to the door, and it was shut, and you’d have a little trapdoor on it. You used to knock the door and ring the bell, and then Hugh and Kevin who were on the door would open the trapdoor: ‘What d’you want?! Oh yeah, it’s you, come in.’ And you’d go in.”
[00:17:45] “The Shilling opened and the door used t be left open. You could see in the pub and that was really unusual. And then people started - I mean, again, the licensing laws have changed - but people drank outside the pub. Actually outside, they were drinking and smoking, well, you could smoke anywhere in those days. And it was a bit more kind of young, a bit more fun.”
[00:19:25] “You were absolutely terrified. At all times. Seriously, it was like, like again, this is how maybe things have gone bad, maybe how people aren’t so aware now. But I remember [being in school ] with the advert with John Hurt and all that kind of malarkey, and you came on the scene and you were absolutely terrified. You think, ‘if I drink a drink…’
[00:22:37] “I didn’t know what I was, I was just doing whatever really]
[00:22:57] “I didn’t really get a lot of hassle with it either, probably because you wouldn’t really, because the tough boys who were going to hit you were the ones you were sleeping with, so you weren’t going to get any problems!”]
[00:24:33] “It was a completely different world. You come from an area that had unemployment, unemployed people, single parent families and you moved into the city and you were suddenly living with boho types, your world completely changes. I am nothing like I was when I first came out. It’s completely opposite.” 00:25:01 “I said to her if you don’t like it that’s your problem… it’s not my issue it’s your issue. If you’ve got a problem then you need to go and get your help.”
[00:33:22] “When the Shilling closed things moved to Old Market but the Shilling reopened and then other clubs opened round the Shilling.”
[00:34:45] “You always had to have a club card and you had to show them your card as well or they might have your name sometimes on a bit of paper… it just got you in the club! But you had to have it.”
[00:35:38] “You used to go to the pub, especially like you’d go to the Elephant and you’d see all the sort of ‘stars’, as it were, like from years ago and they had like women’s names as well, which was weird. It was like: ‘Oh god, they’re called like Cilla and sort of like Dierdre. I wouldn’t say they were speaking Polari, but there was a little bit of it.”
[00:38:06] “That’s how things have changed. It was like going to a village fair, so people would actually make cakes and sell them there. And you had a dance tent, but it wasn’t like a dance-rave tent you would have now at a festival, it was like a smaller version of and you’d have a DJ in there, and you’d like be dancing with the people of the age. So you’d have like Jimmi Sommerville [1980s pop star] there, Marc Almond [pop star] right next to you and you could go and talk to them.”
[00:46:22] “A person writing in a letter to the old youth group, pouring their heart out, you’d know a lot about them before you even met them. And you felt for them and you just had to be grown up about it: how am I going to deal with that right? This person has come and they need some help. So you’d help them out, you’d introduce people. Whereas now, you can go onto Grinder, Gaydar, ping, ping, ping. Oh I’ve met someone - great! Two minutes later I’ve met someone else. What’s that about?”
Martyn [M], born 4 March 1972 on council estate in South Bristol. Left at 17 and moved to Clifton Village. Started working at insurance company and met a man who took him to Elephant [gay pub on St Nicholas Street]. His mother had just moved away so decided to move to new area. Lived in bedsit in a house with Tricky [musician] and lots of journalists and creative people.
[00:01:37] Describes Elephant in 1989. “I remember it being purple but maybe my memories are wrong. And it was quite strange when you were a 16 or 17 year old going in there because everybody new everybody. It was a very small, insular scene. There were lots of characters in there.” Ian Stephens was landlord: describes how he spoke. Above fireplace was sign saying “There are no strangers here, only friends yet to meet” - he found that creepy as a teenager. He also went to the Oasis nightclub. [00:02: 24] “You had to lie about your age because obviously, think about the time. You had to be 21 to be gay, so I had to pretend to be 21, even though I looked about 15.” Story about telling the owners of club his real age. Most clientele were older; many of the younger men there were rent boys. He was offered a lot of money on several occasions. [00:33:30] No gay youth culture that he knew about at the time. Met his partner of the time at Oasis: he was 18, M was 17, therefore breaking the law. [00:03:55] Describes Flo behind the bar at the Oasis. “She was a little lady with a gravelly voice. What was her phrases? She used to go ‘Awwwwwwright?” She’d talk with a really deep voice. You’d go: ‘Whoah!’
[00:04:29] He and partner wanted to meet young people. Found advert in Venue [Bristol listing magazine] with a PO Box for Greenleaf bookshop advertising [he thinks] BLAGS, Bristol Lesbian and Gay Society. “You had to write a letter to the group - and that’s the interesting bit. You had to write this letter to the group, and then you’d be kind of accepted. But what used to happen was, you’d write a letter […] and then the members of the group would then read the letter and try and work out from the letter whether you were gay or not. And remember again you were breaking the law because you were under 21, so you had to be very careful about people, you know, what they might do with that and also because there was a lot of gay bashing at the time.” Two people meet letter-writer to check if they were gay. M and boyfriend went through process and were taken to meet rest of group. [00:05:56]. After joining group, he read letters and met people. Often went with his large, muscular friend from group to meet people. Story about a man from Trowbridge who wrote in, didn’t know anyone gay and worried it might be homophobic trap. [00:06:58] Would meet potential members by Hippodrome or Watershed [venues in Bristol]. After initial conversation, worked out whether they were genuine or not and if they were, took them to Elephant to meet rest of group or Griffin [gay pub on Colston Street], which became the gay youth group’s main meeting place. [00:07:27] Talks about criteria for judging whether people accepted to group: [00:37:34] “I think it was just obvious. It was people just writing, you know, ‘I don’t know anybody, I’m really lonely, I don’t know how to meet people. It’s quite painful, some of the stuff we used to get.” Sometimes people would write but not turn up. [00:07:53] Thinks Gay Switchboard might have been linked to youth group but not sure. In late 1980s, very different from now: people had to know who contact and where to find out information to get in touch with other gay people. Describes Greenleaf bookshop, on Colston Street, which sold feminist and left-wing books. [00:08:31] Doesn’t remember receiving any letters that looked untrustworthy or that they rejected, only remembers ones where the people didn’t turn up as tragic.
[00:08:50] Tries to remember how people contacted the gay youth group and vice versa. He thinks that people wrote to a PO Box number but can’t remember how they communicated back: can’t remember if the people who wrote in gave addresses. [00:09:17] Talks about the members of gay youth group: there were 20-30 members. He is still friends with four people he met there. He thinks youngest person might have been 15 or 16 and oldest 20. Not linked with other gay organisations in area, until Freedom Youth [LGBT youth group] came along several years later. He went to Freedom Youth at very beginning and met current partner there. [00:10:28] “We thought we had to do a role with sexual health as well because it was, again, a different time and sexual health just wasn’t addressed in schools […] but being gay was you know, ‘…and this is very much of a side issue’. Unlike pregnancy, you weren’t taught ‘what do you do if you get an STI? What happens?’” He read about sexual diseases and members of group would go to him if they had problem. He advised on medication or told them to go to the clinic and give them number. This was around 1990. [00:11:47] Thinks age limit for the youth group might have been 25, although he left at 20. Group folded because the leader didn’t want to do it anymore. [00:12:12] Describes membership of youth group as mixed male-female ratio. It mainly served social function. [00:12:24] “We blew up a load of balloons with Gay Switchboard on it and we took them in a net to the centre and we released them all because, again, someone might pick up the leaflet and go: ‘Switchboard. Blimey. I didn’t know that existed.” [00:13:00] Describes Freedom Youth: open people up to 25; based at Terrence Higgins Trust; held workshops - gay youth group more relaxed, less organised, more social. [00:13:49] Describes gay youth group social events: would phone members, tell them what pub to meet at and when. Usually meet at Elephant or Griffin then moved to Oasis or 49 [club on Christmas Steps], a more mixed straight-gay venue. [00:14:24] Describes Oasis club: men-only but once a year held a fundraiser that let in women, so he took his schoolfriend. [00:14:38] “You’d go to the door, and it was shut, and you’d have a little trapdoor on it. You used to knock the door and ring the bell, and then Hugh and Kevin who were on the door would open the trapdoor: ‘What d’you want?! Oh yeah, it’s you, come in.’ And you’d go in.” Everyone had to sign in, as was members-only. To get late licence it had to sell food, so had menu on display, although no-one ever ordered and food probably wasn’t on sale. You went down stairs. First noticeable thing was smell of poppers, then beat of music. When he started going he went early, as he didn’t like going to pubs on his own. Club was tiny and had small garden at back for talking and smoking. It also had two bars, dancefloor and piano in corner, which was played on Sundays. He felt it was stuck in 1970s.
[00:16:55] Talks about changing gay scene in Bristol. There was Elephant, Griffin, Oasis and 49 club, then Queen Shilling opened - he worked there as barman. When it opened, it changed scene because it was a modern pub, whereas Elephant and Griffin seemed closed, with closed curtains. [00:17:45] “The Shilling opened and the door used to be left open. You could see in the pub and that was really unusual. And then people started - I mean, again, the licensing laws have changed - but people drank outside the pub. Actually outside, they were drinking and smoking, well, you could smoke anywhere in those days. And it was a bit more kind of young, a bit more fun.” By late 1980s/early 1990s, he’d started going to Bang and Heaven [London clubs] and he’d seen what pubs and clubs could look like. Queen Shilling reminded him of London pub. When it opened in 1992 or 1993 Queen Shilling was pub rather than club, with bar on ground floor and raised dancefloor, so it was possible to sit and talk.
[00:19:23] He was terrified of AIDS as a young man. [00:19:25] “You were absolutely terrified. At all times. Seriously, it was like, like again, this is how maybe things have gone bad, maybe how people aren’t so aware now. But I remember [being in school] with the advert with John Hurt and all that kind of malarkey, and you came on the scene and you were absolutely terrified. You think, ‘if I drink a drink…’ He was frightened he might catch AIDS from glass in pub. Everyone was into safe sex, it was the norm. Now, it has changed and people are complacent because of anti-viral drugs and PEP. [00:20:28 - SOUND INTERFERENCE AS MICROPHONE DROPS OFF AND IS PINNED BACK ON] [00:20:50] Talks about safe sex education in late 1980s. Remembers John Hurt information film, thinks there may have been posters in Griffin. Condoms sold in Elephant. Responsibility was down to individual, who had to go and buy them: weren’t distributed free. Thinks safe sex was norm because of mass hysteria at time. [00:21:36] Story about article he read Sun newspaper about airline pilot bringing AIDS to UK. He doesn’t remember massive safe sex campaigns at time. Later it became part of youth group’s activity. Describes change in attitude at Milne Centre [STD clinic at BRI].
[00:22:16] He had boyfriends and girlfriends at school. [00:22:26 - CLOCK CHIMES] [00:22:37] “I didn’t know what I was, I was just doing whatever really] He had close female friends that he talked to about relationships with boys and it was a non-issue. [00:22:57] “I didn’t really get a lot of hassle with it either, probably because you wouldn’t really, because the tough boys who were going to hit you were the ones you were sleeping with, so you weren’t going to get any problems!” [00:23:25] Story about meeting old schoolfriend after they left school, who was amazed M was gay. Didn’t come out in school or to family -environment was too tough. Came out when he left home. [00:24:33] “It was a completely different world. You come from an area that had unemployment, unemployed people, single parent families and you moved into the city and you were suddenly living with boho types, your world completely changes. I am nothing like I was when I first came out. It’s completely opposite.” [00:24:57] His family now know he’s gay: he told his mother when she moved away when he was 17yo. [00:25:01] “I said to her if you don’t like it that’s your problem… it’s not my issue it’s your issue. If you’ve got a problem then you need to go and get your help.” [00:25:34] He lived in Clifton for three years: knew that was where lots of gay people lived. Story about conversation overheard on bus on day he moved to Clifton. After three years, moved to Brislington, which was boring. [00:26:55] After he left youth group, joined Stonewall, but mainly focused on having good time, clubbing in London, discovering Brighton. [00:27:33] Describes changing gay scene. Once Queen Shilling opened, others opened, like Flamingo Joe’s/Leo’s club, next to Elephant, around 1995-1996. Boy bands performed there, and LaToya Jackson. He worked there as barman. [00:28:29 - PHONE RINGS] [00:28:47] Describes Flamingo Joe’s: it had two bars, burger bar, big stage. He thinks it was too big and went bankrupt, as was only busy on weekends. [00:29:12] Talks about Oasis, which had limit on numbers, so if you couldn’t get in on new year’s eve, you probably couldn’t get in anywhere.
[00:29:50] As barman, M got free entry to all gay pubs and clubs in Bristol. After finishing shift he’d go to 49, Flamingo’s and Just [club]. Talks about what clubs were open and what had shut. Owner of Queen Shilling was renovating pub and deciding whether to move to Old Market because first gay venue on Old Market, Roosters, had opened. Then Old Castle Green taken over by former landlords of Griffin and owner of Just, Winn, was told club would be demolished. He turned old Lloyds Bank into club. By this stage Old Market Tavern was gay. There was also Castro’s, near Stag and Hounds. Whole scene moved to Old Market and because Queen Shilling was shut, young scene came too. He was in his mid-20s by now. Griffin became leather bar. Elephant was still traditional gay pub, but dying a bit. Around same time, Pineapple and Vibes opened. [00:33:22] “When the Shilling closed things moved to Old Market but the Shilling reopened and then other clubs opened round the Shilling.” Roosters closed and Mason’s Arms, a women’s bar opened. [00:33:53] He brings out membership cards of clubs from the time. He talks about membership card for Just on Fiennes Court; card for Winn’s (now R7, which he hasn’t been to). All clubs used to have membership cards, including Queen Shilling; not the case now. [00:34:45] “You always had to have a club card and you had to show them your card as well or they might have your name sometimes on a bit of paper… it just got you in the club! But you had to have it.” Bristol led way in social life - Just had first 24-hour licence in country: tested in Bristol. Went on until 6am and gave free toast and coffee to anyone who was still there. [00:35:38] “You used to go to the pub, especially like you’d go to the Elephant and you’d see all the sort of ‘stars’, as it were, like from years ago and they had like women’s names as well, which was weird. It was like: ‘Oh god, they’re called like Cilla and sort of like Dierdre. I wouldn’t say they were speaking Polari, but there was a little bit of it.” Mentions another local character called Tracey, who spoke Polari: he didn’t know what it was at time. Found out about it through Round the Horne [1960s Radio programme].
[00:36:28] If there was show on at Hippodrome [Bristol theatre] stars would always go to Oasis afterwards and get in free. [00:36:50] Shows ‘Glad to be gay’ flag from London Pride 1997. Coach trips from Bristol were organised each year from Bristol to London for Pride. Banners would be taken and people would march through London for their city - he doesn’t think this happens at Pride any more. He often went to Pride in London. His first was 1990 or 1991. [00:38:06] “That’s how things have changed. It was like going to a village fair, so people would actually make cakes and sell them there. And you had a dance tent, but it wasn’t like a dance-rave tent you would have now at a festival, it was like a smaller version of and you’d have a DJ in there, and you’d like be dancing with the people of the age. So you’d have like Jimmi Sommerville [1980s pop star] there, Marc Almond [pop star] right next to you and you could go and talk to them.” Very different to ‘superpride’/Mardi Gras experience of later years. He used to go as teenager with schoolfriends and was thrilled to be dancing with people he’d seen on Top of the Pops [TV programme]. The trips from Bristol to London were advertised on posters in gay pubs. You’d phone (he thinks it may have been through Greenleaf bookshop), get ticket, meet at designated place and go on bus. He did it every year until trips finished. [00:40:58] Talks about Pride London moving around and commercialism of event. Used to be able to take own alcohol and food. No gates around venue, so people could walk in. Then gates introduced, followed by wristbands, then token payment system. By time it was held in Hyde Park [2006?] it was ruined. He went to Pride 2012 in London in Trafalgar Square but didn’t enjoy it: just stalls giving out leaflets.
[00:41:21] Talks about Bristol Pride. First one he went to was in Watershed; he thinks it was organised by Berkeley [Berkeley Wilde, local activist]. Couple of Prides were held there in 1990s. Then one was held at the Trinity Centre [venue in Lawrence Hill]: didn’t work out because of far-flung location. He also went on march through Bristol with Freedom Youth. Little reaction to it from passersby. He doesn’t think Bristol is particularly homophobic, though he has been beaten up. [00:43:23] Talks about area he lives in [doesn’t want to say where it is]. All his friends live there and all go to the local pub and no-one bothers them. That wouldn’t have happened when he was younger. Finds now that there are few gay pubs where he can sit and chat: too loud. When he was teenager there were pubs where you could do this. Doesn’t find this in Brighton, where there is more variety on scene. [00:43:35 - TRY TO PAUSE TAPE WHILE HE GETS PHOTOGRAPHS OUT. PAUSE BUTTON DOESN’T WORK.] [00:44:47] V013 is shown photo of M when he was a teenager and had lots of bleached blonde hair and is standing in front of a Marilyn Monroe poster. [00:45:01] Describes picture of his friend’s 16th birthday at 49 club: it is of friend from gay youth group, school friends and other friends they met along way. Drinking underage at pubs and clubs was common. [00:45:42] Talks about how Bristol has changed: more open city; more choice of clubs. On old scene, it felt closed and bitchy. He doesn’t understand how young people make friends today through social networking. People talk about problems online but not face to face. [00:46:22] “A person writing in a letter to the old youth group, pouring their heart out, you’d know a lot about them before you even met them. And you felt for them and you just had to be grown up about it: how am I going to deal with that right? This person has come and they need some help. So you’d help them out, you’d introduce people. Whereas now, you can go onto Grinder, Gaydar, ping, ping, ping. Oh I’ve met someone - great! Two minutes later I’ve met someone else. What’s that about?” [00:47:20] He has been with his partner 18 years. They met at Freedom Youth. [00: 48:07] Of all places he has lived in Bristol, where he lives now [doesn’t want to say where] is his favourite because so many gay people live there. Story about going to local bar and it being full of gay people. He occasionally goes out on scene, mainly to Old Market Tavern. Story about visiting bar in Old Market, where he saw young man drinking from cocktail pitcher. (Male) staff behind bar are topless - he would have been unhappy doing it when he was barman and questions whether it should be part of job description. Talks about his days as barman, when customers would pour heart out to him, people crying at end of night. [00:51:57] Talks about gay night club called Lock Hill, on a boat in docks near where Bordeaux Quay now is, for a few months. [00:52:22 - CLOCK CHIMES] It had a bar and dancefloor - thinks it was the only gay club on boat in the UK. It attracted same crowd as rest of scene.
GOLDEN QUOTES [00:04:02] “She was a little lady with a gravelly voice. What was her phrases? She used to go ‘Awwwwwwright?” She’d talk with a really deep voice. You’d go: ‘Whoah!’
[00:04:53] “You had to write a letter to the group - and that’s the interesting bit. You had to write this letter to the group, and then you’d be kind of accepted. But what used to happen was, you’d write a letter […] and then the members of the group would then read the letter and try and work out from the letter whether you were gay or not. And remember again you were breaking the law because you were under 21, so you had to be very careful about people, you know, what they might do with that and also because there was a lot of gay bashing at the time.”
[00:37:34] “I think it was just obvious. It was people just writing, you know, ‘I don’ know anybody, I’m really lonely, I don’t know how to meet people. It’s quite painful, some of the stuff we used to get.”
[00:10:28] “We thought we had to do a role with sexual health as well because it was, again, a different time and sexual health just wasn’t addressed in schools […] but being gay was you know, ‘…and this is very much of a side issue’. Unlike pregnancy, you weren’t taught ‘what do you do if you get an STI? What happens?’
[00:12:24] “We blew up a load of balloons with Gay Switchboard on it and we took them in a net to the centre and we released them all because, again, someone might pick up the leaflet and go: ‘Switchboard. Blimey. I didn’t know that existed.”
[00:14:38] “You’d go to the door, and it was shut, and you’d have a little trapdoor on it. You used to knock the door and ring the bell, and then Hugh and Kevin who were on the door would open the trapdoor: ‘What d’you want?! Oh yeah, it’s you, come in.’ And you’d go in.”
[00:17:45] “The Shilling opened and the door used t be left open. You could see in the pub and that was really unusual. And then people started - I mean, again, the licensing laws have changed - but people drank outside the pub. Actually outside, they were drinking and smoking, well, you could smoke anywhere in those days. And it was a bit more kind of young, a bit more fun.”
[00:19:25] “You were absolutely terrified. At all times. Seriously, it was like, like again, this is how maybe things have gone bad, maybe how people aren’t so aware now. But I remember [being in school ] with the advert with John Hurt and all that kind of malarkey, and you came on the scene and you were absolutely terrified. You think, ‘if I drink a drink…’
[00:22:37] “I didn’t know what I was, I was just doing whatever really]
[00:22:57] “I didn’t really get a lot of hassle with it either, probably because you wouldn’t really, because the tough boys who were going to hit you were the ones you were sleeping with, so you weren’t going to get any problems!”]
[00:24:33] “It was a completely different world. You come from an area that had unemployment, unemployed people, single parent families and you moved into the city and you were suddenly living with boho types, your world completely changes. I am nothing like I was when I first came out. It’s completely opposite.” 00:25:01 “I said to her if you don’t like it that’s your problem… it’s not my issue it’s your issue. If you’ve got a problem then you need to go and get your help.”
[00:33:22] “When the Shilling closed things moved to Old Market but the Shilling reopened and then other clubs opened round the Shilling.”
[00:34:45] “You always had to have a club card and you had to show them your card as well or they might have your name sometimes on a bit of paper… it just got you in the club! But you had to have it.”
[00:35:38] “You used to go to the pub, especially like you’d go to the Elephant and you’d see all the sort of ‘stars’, as it were, like from years ago and they had like women’s names as well, which was weird. It was like: ‘Oh god, they’re called like Cilla and sort of like Dierdre. I wouldn’t say they were speaking Polari, but there was a little bit of it.”
[00:38:06] “That’s how things have changed. It was like going to a village fair, so people would actually make cakes and sell them there. And you had a dance tent, but it wasn’t like a dance-rave tent you would have now at a festival, it was like a smaller version of and you’d have a DJ in there, and you’d like be dancing with the people of the age. So you’d have like Jimmi Sommerville [1980s pop star] there, Marc Almond [pop star] right next to you and you could go and talk to them.”
[00:46:22] “A person writing in a letter to the old youth group, pouring their heart out, you’d know a lot about them before you even met them. And you felt for them and you just had to be grown up about it: how am I going to deal with that right? This person has come and they need some help. So you’d help them out, you’d introduce people. Whereas now, you can go onto Grinder, Gaydar, ping, ping, ping. Oh I’ve met someone - great! Two minutes later I’ve met someone else. What’s that about?”
