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OH443 Interview with Peter main (OutStories Bristol)
Please note this is not a full correct transcript but a detailed summary of the recording
00:00:00 - Introduction. 00:00:36 - Peter (PM) introduces himself as first openly gay mayor of Bristol. Brief overview of story coming to Bristol: Meeting partner Gordon in North Kent, they were together for 34 years. Meeting in Kent, moving to Bath in March 1980 after being together five years. Bought a house in Bristol and settled in St. George area in Bristol. Lived there until 2009, when Gordon died (June 5, 2009). Working through the grieving process. Selling up, moving house and moving into rented accommodation. 00:03:13 - Living in Brislington, as elected councillor. Elected in 1997. Becoming Lord Mayor and dedicating role in office to Gordon. 00:03:55 - Working in local government in Bath City Council, and deciding to move to the west country. Bath was too expensive, and PM was attracted to Bristol as a place to live. Chose to live in Bristol without thinking of the gay scene, the decision was based on something different. 00:05:00 - First impressions of Bristol. Living in Bristol for a few months on his own before Gordon came in 1980. The only place PM knew was the only gay pub at the time, The Elephant on St. Nicholas St. Sat in by himself most days of the week, meeting Gordon on weekends, but went to sit in The Elephant one night a week. It was pretty boring, as it was a bit of a meat market: full of rather rough rent boys, but after a few weeks of being there someone came up and started talking to him and PM made a good friend. Also went to gay pub in Bath. 00:07:18 - Gordon moved to Bristol, and they got to know a few friends in the community. Both were involved in politics and made friends through that part of life. Getting involved in [social group] Avonscene, which met at the Gay Centre, was in a warehouse near where the SS Great Britain is today. Memories of going there including a Christmas party in midsummer. There was not much of a commercial scene: one gay pub, one gay club, but this offered something more. Early on there was a rivalry between Gay West and Avonscene, but they eventually merged. Losing interest in the non-commercial scene, going to very few things. 00:09:32 - Avonscene: set up by people who didn't like the commercial gay scene, bristol based, merging with Gay West eventually. Hosted quizzes, parties, social gatherings, meals at people's houses. Rivalry, came from natural rivalry between Bath and Bristol, Bristol bigger but Bath felt itself to be better. 00:11:05 - Going to theatre a lot, outings to theatre in Bath with Avonscene, but became more involved in the growing commercial scene. The Elephant and the Oasis club in Park Row - the only gay club in Bristol in the early 1980s. Another opened in late 1980s, the 49 club which had sticky carpets. Describing the Oasis, it was very crowded on New Year's Eve as it was the only place to go.
00:12:35 - The Early 1980s was very different, there was antipathy and homophobic bullying. Gordon and PM didn't experience much homophobia, they had each other and had straight friends and gay friends. Remembers one evening in the Elephant when it was CS-gassed - it was quite scary, everyone rushed out into the street. Gordon and PM went to the Oasis most weekends; going out, by then they had a lot of friends. 00:14:43 - The Oasis: Basement, looking out on Park Row, very claustrophobic, crowded, there was a big gay community at the time and so they went there, sometimes stayed too late. PM never enjoyed staying out too late - sometimes PM would go home earlier, and Gordon would walk home later. Being on the pull, but can't remember meeting a nice one there. The guy who owned it was a freemason. 00:16:19 - PM and Gordon eventually stopped going out, got bored with it all eventually. Getting more involved in politics, when the Social Democratic Party (SDP) was set up - Gordon and PM were founding members of the SDP. During the late 1980s and early 1990s, trying to get elected onto the council for St. George, and later on in Brislington. Eventually elected in 1997 after losing about seven elections and then winning the eighth. Didn't put sexuality on his leaflets; wanting to be judged for being a good councillor rather than for being a gay councillor. Same with his office today; being a good lord mayor, not a gay lord mayor. 00:18:43 - Motivation for political career. Saw room for improvement and ways to help people, got involved in local campaigns - talking to people and asking them what they wanted, gaining support to get elected. The other parties weren't doing that. Not putting leaflets out just at election time, spoke up for people and were seen as active in the area. 00:20:20 - Being a councillor and being gay. Choice of being open, not hiding sexuality but not trying to campaign on a platform of being gay. Most people knew he had a partner and knew Gordon. Being gay was not an issue within the party. 00:21:30 - Gordon's involvement in politics: working behind the scenes, getting the word out, never wanting to be in front and be a councillor. 00:22:30 - Changing view of PM as a gay councillor over time. Not hiding himself, but not emphasising difference. Was a member of the campaign for homosexual equality (CHE) in the beginning, but did not feel too militant about rights. Wanting people to get to know him first as a person, not chiefly based on sexuality. 00:24:50 - Life as a councillor - 15 years, highlights or points of change: Seeing the party gain seats, being the 12th person elected and now having 30 odd councillors. Seeing policies go into effect in Bristol, and seeing changes in the way the city was being run. Working to make Bristol run better, working to make changes in Bristol, creating a vibrant city. 00:26:15 - Seeing Bristol's gay community grow, more gay bars, clubs, pubs. More desirable things happening in the gay scene, although it’s quite youth oriented. This not necessarily due to the council's efforts, just a natural thing in Bristol. 00:27:20 - Homosexuality decriminalised when PM was 18, things have got easier since then. Gordon and PM suffering antipathy from society and living their own life together. 00:28:25 - 1980s and 1990s brought the 'gay plague' AIDS. Seeing friends die from HIV, knowing people with HIV, at the time it was a killer. Attitudes of the press, the idea that gay people are more promiscuous than straight people, origins of HIV. Horrendous and scary time to live in as a gay couple.
00:29:51 - Meeting Gordon: March 11th 1975 in a gay friendly pub in Margate in Kent. Gordon was wearing a white suit, they got on well and saw each other a lot. Living together and buying a house in 1978, before moving to Bristol/Bath in 1980. Moving to Bristol liberating, providing separation from family and finding a new home. Some family members quite supporting, others not in the early days. 00:32:15 - Leaving home. Parents found out that PM had slept with a man, and thought he needed to see a psychiatrist. Choosing to leave home, and went to Margate. Went to live with a guy who kicked PM out after about a month. Memory of weeping on his partner's doorstop, before going into digs to live. Living in digs, living with a family as a sort of boarder until PM and Gordon bought their own home. 00:34:50 - Coming Out. Never coming out in a particular moment, parents found out and were a bit Victorian and hard-line towards it. Father blamed PM's mother, on the theory that gayness was caused by an overweening mother. Father drinking a lot and parents being on the verge of a break up. Heard his own name mentioned as part of parent's divorce, father blaming mother for making son gay in county court. 00:36:25 - Developing and repairing relationship with PM's father. Father eventually accepting Gordon. Close, but not intimate relationship. Mother taking to religion after divorce, and finding the Pentecostal church which was against homosexuality. Mother then rejected PM and Gordon. Wouldn't visit, wouldn't see PM. Brothers and sister were always more supportive. 00:38:50 - Six or seven years ago, PM slightly reconciled with mother after she had a stroke and was a quadriplegic. PM went to visit her over the course of three or four years. Around this time Gordon had become an alcoholic, and was not well. PM never recognising the 'tipping point' in preventing Gordon's illness. Gordon nearly died in 2006, which motivated the decision to take out their civil partnership.
00:40:35 - Losing Gordon. After that first warning, Gordon wasn't able to overcome the addiction, had a number of spells and went into hospital. Around the election in 2009, Gordon went to bed after not being well and he didn't get up the following day. PM coming home, finding Gordon still in bed and ringing 999. Gordon taken to hospital, and PM realised that it was not like before: this time PM might not be able to take Gordon back home like in the past. Very painful to see Gordon in the hospital with them trying to make him better. Being there when Gordon died, saying he loved him, and waiting for his family to arrive. 00:45:45 - Life changing after living with Gordon for 35 years. Description of PM's home and a portrait of PM and Gordon, overlooking the room. Gordon remaining with PM in spirit. Explaining the difficulty of losing a partner, and taking up the cause of gay bereavement. There is no gay bereavement counselling in Bristol. Grieving was supported by friends and personal resilience. Feeling guilty and annoyed that PM and Gordon couldn't go through with plans to spend old age together. Coming to grips with grief.
00:50:00 - Gordon encouraged PM to become Lord Mayor, always told people PM would become one but never lived to see it himself. Gordon never wanted to be the Mayor's consort, but now PM honours Gordon by acting in this role. Proudest moment leading Pride down Park St. as the first openly gay mayor of Bristol, a very special experience. There will be many highlights, but leading pride was an amazing experience. 00:52:36 - Pride over the years. Going to Pride over the years, going to Manchester the 'gay mecca' when PM was growing up. In Bristol it happened spasmodically. He was really pleased to see it get pulled off in 2012, especially as it was during his term of being Lord Mayor. 00:55:23 - Closing comments: Bristol is 'my adopted city', almost as soon as he came he grew to love the city. Bristol is a unique city with a unique and diverse history.
00:00:00 - Introduction. 00:00:36 - Peter (PM) introduces himself as first openly gay mayor of Bristol. Brief overview of story coming to Bristol: Meeting partner Gordon in North Kent, they were together for 34 years. Meeting in Kent, moving to Bath in March 1980 after being together five years. Bought a house in Bristol and settled in St. George area in Bristol. Lived there until 2009, when Gordon died (June 5, 2009). Working through the grieving process. Selling up, moving house and moving into rented accommodation. 00:03:13 - Living in Brislington, as elected councillor. Elected in 1997. Becoming Lord Mayor and dedicating role in office to Gordon. 00:03:55 - Working in local government in Bath City Council, and deciding to move to the west country. Bath was too expensive, and PM was attracted to Bristol as a place to live. Chose to live in Bristol without thinking of the gay scene, the decision was based on something different. 00:05:00 - First impressions of Bristol. Living in Bristol for a few months on his own before Gordon came in 1980. The only place PM knew was the only gay pub at the time, The Elephant on St. Nicholas St. Sat in by himself most days of the week, meeting Gordon on weekends, but went to sit in The Elephant one night a week. It was pretty boring, as it was a bit of a meat market: full of rather rough rent boys, but after a few weeks of being there someone came up and started talking to him and PM made a good friend. Also went to gay pub in Bath. 00:07:18 - Gordon moved to Bristol, and they got to know a few friends in the community. Both were involved in politics and made friends through that part of life. Getting involved in [social group] Avonscene, which met at the Gay Centre, was in a warehouse near where the SS Great Britain is today. Memories of going there including a Christmas party in midsummer. There was not much of a commercial scene: one gay pub, one gay club, but this offered something more. Early on there was a rivalry between Gay West and Avonscene, but they eventually merged. Losing interest in the non-commercial scene, going to very few things. 00:09:32 - Avonscene: set up by people who didn't like the commercial gay scene, bristol based, merging with Gay West eventually. Hosted quizzes, parties, social gatherings, meals at people's houses. Rivalry, came from natural rivalry between Bath and Bristol, Bristol bigger but Bath felt itself to be better. 00:11:05 - Going to theatre a lot, outings to theatre in Bath with Avonscene, but became more involved in the growing commercial scene. The Elephant and the Oasis club in Park Row - the only gay club in Bristol in the early 1980s. Another opened in late 1980s, the 49 club which had sticky carpets. Describing the Oasis, it was very crowded on New Year's Eve as it was the only place to go.
00:12:35 - The Early 1980s was very different, there was antipathy and homophobic bullying. Gordon and PM didn't experience much homophobia, they had each other and had straight friends and gay friends. Remembers one evening in the Elephant when it was CS-gassed - it was quite scary, everyone rushed out into the street. Gordon and PM went to the Oasis most weekends; going out, by then they had a lot of friends. 00:14:43 - The Oasis: Basement, looking out on Park Row, very claustrophobic, crowded, there was a big gay community at the time and so they went there, sometimes stayed too late. PM never enjoyed staying out too late - sometimes PM would go home earlier, and Gordon would walk home later. Being on the pull, but can't remember meeting a nice one there. The guy who owned it was a freemason. 00:16:19 - PM and Gordon eventually stopped going out, got bored with it all eventually. Getting more involved in politics, when the Social Democratic Party (SDP) was set up - Gordon and PM were founding members of the SDP. During the late 1980s and early 1990s, trying to get elected onto the council for St. George, and later on in Brislington. Eventually elected in 1997 after losing about seven elections and then winning the eighth. Didn't put sexuality on his leaflets; wanting to be judged for being a good councillor rather than for being a gay councillor. Same with his office today; being a good lord mayor, not a gay lord mayor. 00:18:43 - Motivation for political career. Saw room for improvement and ways to help people, got involved in local campaigns - talking to people and asking them what they wanted, gaining support to get elected. The other parties weren't doing that. Not putting leaflets out just at election time, spoke up for people and were seen as active in the area. 00:20:20 - Being a councillor and being gay. Choice of being open, not hiding sexuality but not trying to campaign on a platform of being gay. Most people knew he had a partner and knew Gordon. Being gay was not an issue within the party. 00:21:30 - Gordon's involvement in politics: working behind the scenes, getting the word out, never wanting to be in front and be a councillor. 00:22:30 - Changing view of PM as a gay councillor over time. Not hiding himself, but not emphasising difference. Was a member of the campaign for homosexual equality (CHE) in the beginning, but did not feel too militant about rights. Wanting people to get to know him first as a person, not chiefly based on sexuality. 00:24:50 - Life as a councillor - 15 years, highlights or points of change: Seeing the party gain seats, being the 12th person elected and now having 30 odd councillors. Seeing policies go into effect in Bristol, and seeing changes in the way the city was being run. Working to make Bristol run better, working to make changes in Bristol, creating a vibrant city. 00:26:15 - Seeing Bristol's gay community grow, more gay bars, clubs, pubs. More desirable things happening in the gay scene, although it’s quite youth oriented. This not necessarily due to the council's efforts, just a natural thing in Bristol. 00:27:20 - Homosexuality decriminalised when PM was 18, things have got easier since then. Gordon and PM suffering antipathy from society and living their own life together. 00:28:25 - 1980s and 1990s brought the 'gay plague' AIDS. Seeing friends die from HIV, knowing people with HIV, at the time it was a killer. Attitudes of the press, the idea that gay people are more promiscuous than straight people, origins of HIV. Horrendous and scary time to live in as a gay couple.
00:29:51 - Meeting Gordon: March 11th 1975 in a gay friendly pub in Margate in Kent. Gordon was wearing a white suit, they got on well and saw each other a lot. Living together and buying a house in 1978, before moving to Bristol/Bath in 1980. Moving to Bristol liberating, providing separation from family and finding a new home. Some family members quite supporting, others not in the early days. 00:32:15 - Leaving home. Parents found out that PM had slept with a man, and thought he needed to see a psychiatrist. Choosing to leave home, and went to Margate. Went to live with a guy who kicked PM out after about a month. Memory of weeping on his partner's doorstop, before going into digs to live. Living in digs, living with a family as a sort of boarder until PM and Gordon bought their own home. 00:34:50 - Coming Out. Never coming out in a particular moment, parents found out and were a bit Victorian and hard-line towards it. Father blamed PM's mother, on the theory that gayness was caused by an overweening mother. Father drinking a lot and parents being on the verge of a break up. Heard his own name mentioned as part of parent's divorce, father blaming mother for making son gay in county court. 00:36:25 - Developing and repairing relationship with PM's father. Father eventually accepting Gordon. Close, but not intimate relationship. Mother taking to religion after divorce, and finding the Pentecostal church which was against homosexuality. Mother then rejected PM and Gordon. Wouldn't visit, wouldn't see PM. Brothers and sister were always more supportive. 00:38:50 - Six or seven years ago, PM slightly reconciled with mother after she had a stroke and was a quadriplegic. PM went to visit her over the course of three or four years. Around this time Gordon had become an alcoholic, and was not well. PM never recognising the 'tipping point' in preventing Gordon's illness. Gordon nearly died in 2006, which motivated the decision to take out their civil partnership.
00:40:35 - Losing Gordon. After that first warning, Gordon wasn't able to overcome the addiction, had a number of spells and went into hospital. Around the election in 2009, Gordon went to bed after not being well and he didn't get up the following day. PM coming home, finding Gordon still in bed and ringing 999. Gordon taken to hospital, and PM realised that it was not like before: this time PM might not be able to take Gordon back home like in the past. Very painful to see Gordon in the hospital with them trying to make him better. Being there when Gordon died, saying he loved him, and waiting for his family to arrive. 00:45:45 - Life changing after living with Gordon for 35 years. Description of PM's home and a portrait of PM and Gordon, overlooking the room. Gordon remaining with PM in spirit. Explaining the difficulty of losing a partner, and taking up the cause of gay bereavement. There is no gay bereavement counselling in Bristol. Grieving was supported by friends and personal resilience. Feeling guilty and annoyed that PM and Gordon couldn't go through with plans to spend old age together. Coming to grips with grief.
00:50:00 - Gordon encouraged PM to become Lord Mayor, always told people PM would become one but never lived to see it himself. Gordon never wanted to be the Mayor's consort, but now PM honours Gordon by acting in this role. Proudest moment leading Pride down Park St. as the first openly gay mayor of Bristol, a very special experience. There will be many highlights, but leading pride was an amazing experience. 00:52:36 - Pride over the years. Going to Pride over the years, going to Manchester the 'gay mecca' when PM was growing up. In Bristol it happened spasmodically. He was really pleased to see it get pulled off in 2012, especially as it was during his term of being Lord Mayor. 00:55:23 - Closing comments: Bristol is 'my adopted city', almost as soon as he came he grew to love the city. Bristol is a unique city with a unique and diverse history.
